DISPELLING LEFTIST MYTHS ABOUT CHRIST

Panzerhund

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It means a great deal to me to hear that.

I have weights to lift and another walk to take with the dog but I'll get to the Mark of the Beast/Star of David thing later on today if I can.
Looking forward to this immensely!
 

Werwolf

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Looking forward to this immensely!
Same. I've always heard so much about the Mark of the Beast, and honestly some of my first memories of being a child in church, that was more "scary" to me than burning in hell for some reason. I don't know why lil Werwolf was more worried about the mark of the beast, but the mind of a kid picks up certain things I guess...
 

Astral-Pepe

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Some people prefer bench press with dumb bells more because of the isolation factor on each hand.
I sometimes do dumbbell bench press using an exercise ball for a bench. That gives you a serious balance/core workout at the same time. It it just as hard as 150% as much weight on a bar.
 

Auslander-Raus!

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I laughed at my own joke before, hopefully somebody gets it and the relevance to this thread:

Tammuz, the original motherfucking god.

:LOL:
 

Astral-Pepe

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I want to deal with the Mark of the Beast and the Star of David but first I should probably deal with the concept known as The Antichrist because it often adds to the confusion of Christian eschatology.

I have said much of the following a few times on the bbs so what I want to do here is consolidate and be a little more thoughrough.

Like I have said before; there is no "The Antichrist" anywhere in Scripture.

The term antichrist appears only four times and each time the word translated is a the very specific and clearly understandable word antichristos.



Lets take a look at all four passages to get a solid understanding so that we are never led astray on this issue:

1 John 2

18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1

7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


Those who want to tell you that there is a singular evil entity known as The Antichrist who will appear at some point in the future are mistaken. They are either willfully blind to the above Scriptures or they are deceiving you on purpose.

Every single jew is antichrist. Every single moslem, Hindu, Buddhist, Atheist and every other pagan is antichrist. Scripture makes it clear that there are many antichrists and that they are already in the world. You can also see from 1 John 2:18 and 1 John 4:3 that there was confusion even at that time about the coming of antichrist.

Sometimes certain passages from Daniel are interpreted to support the concept of a singular Antichrist:

Daniel 11

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.


2 Thessalonians 2
is most often used to support this concept of a singular Antichrist who will exalt himself above God, work lying wonders, cause himself to be worshipped etc.:

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


and

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,


You can see how people could become confused by this and how they could be led astray but we are told that a love of the truth will save us from being deceived:

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

This ties in nicely with the Mark of the Beast.

We are told that only those whose names are not written in the Book of Life will be deceived by the Beast:

Revelation 13

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


and:

Revelation 17

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.


Our names were written in the Book of Life before the world was framed. God knew us before we were born:

Jeremiah 1

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


We were already in Heaven and no one can go to Heaven who didn't come from there:

John 3

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


We are the elect and we will not be deceived:

Matthew 24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.


Ok, that's great Astral-Pepe, I feel really relieved that I won't get fooled into taking this Mark of the Beast but what is it exactly?

Before we go further lets look at the two words that get translated as beast in Revelation because only this book talks about the Mark of the Beast directly.

The first word is zoon and it just means a living creature.



This is the word translated beast in reference to the four beasts in attendance to the throne:

Revelation 4

7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.


This is an unfortunate translation because it is confusing given the circumstances. The word probably should have been translated "living creatures" or better yet cherubs because these are likely cherubs.

Notice the similarities to cherubs described in Ezekiel:

Ezekiel 10

14 And every one had four faces: the first face was the face of a cherub, and the second face was the face of a man, and the third the face of a lion, and the fourth the face of an eagle.


Anyway, the other word is the one we are more concerned with here. The word that gets translated as beast in the context of the Mark of the Beast is the word thérion which means a threatening, dangerous animal.





The symbology of the beasts of Revelation and the beasts in the book of Daniel are very similar and Daniel's final beast seems to be the same as the beast referred to in Revelation.

Compare:

Daniel 7

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.


With:

Revelation 13

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.


Over the centuries many have tried to interpret these prophecies in ways that suited their times and their particular denominational slant.

The early Protestant Reformers thought the Beast was the Catholic church or the Pope or some combination of those things.

They made a point to note the seven mountains which the city of Rome sits on:

Revelation 17

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.




and they drew a connection to the number of the Beast with the Roman Church:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.






You still see certain Protestant types, Southern Baptists in particular, promoting this viewpoint.

In response to the Reformers, a Jesuit named Luis del Alcázar wrote Vestigatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi (1614). In this work he makes the case that the vast majority of Biblical prophecy had already been fulfilled by 70AD. The conflict, he contends, is between the church and Judaism initially and then between the church and pagan Rome. The final triumph in Revelation is the triumph of the church.

His book contains some great illustrations that ended up being as influential as his ideas.



You can get his book here but be advised; it is 1000+ pages in Latin:


His view, with some embellishments, is still popular. Those who support it find the number of the Beast in Nero's name:



and they also point to the seven mountains of Rome, but instead they connect them to the Roman Empire.



More recently there have developed newer ideas about what the Beast and it's Mark are.

Some claim the European Union is the Beast, they claim it is attempting to rebuild Babel and they claim that the twelve stars in the EU logo represent the crown of twelve stars mentioned in Revelation 12:

Revelation 12

1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:






This interpretation completely misunderstands the Scriptures. The woman in Revelation 12 is not the whore who rides the Beast but instead she represents the people of God:

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This is about us, only we have the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. We are the remnant of her seed who will fight the dragon. I have mentioned before that this is the very first prophecy in the Bible:

Genesis 3

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.


Some theories are quite simple and don't bother trying to tie Scripture in at all. People have proposed all kinds of things including the coins of Rome, social security numbers, bar codes and, most recently, the Covid vaccine as the Mark of the Beast.




Some of these theories don't stand up to even rudimentary scrutiny:

Revelation 14

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,


Obviously I don't support any of the ideas I have listed so far. The Beast, we are told, will have diverse body parts, seven heads and ten crowns (sometimes horns):

Revelation 13

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.


This is clearly not one single thing, as much as people with an axe to grind want to see it that way.

It is a whole system of evil working at odds with Jesus and against his people. The most striking thing for us should immediately be that the jews are let off the hook by all of these ideas even though they are the central figures in opposition to Christianity.



They are, after all, the Synagogue of Satan:

Revelation 3

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


They are the merchants mentioned here and elsewhere:

Revelation 18

23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


The word translated "sorceries" here is the Greek word pharmakeia:



Clearly they have used medicine and drugs to deceive the nations.



Jerusalem is on seven hills:





Jerusalem is very clearly that great city where Jesus was crucified:

Revelation 11

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.


Sodom means sexual degeneracy and mongrelization while Egypt is symbolic of slavery. "Where also our Lord was crucified" proves this can't be any other place than Jerusalem.

Simple algebra (if A equals B and B equals C then A must also equal C) proves that Jerusalem is also the Babylon mentioned throughout Revelation:

Revelation 14

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.


and the woman riding the Beast:

Revelation 17

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


who is also the whore:

Revelation 17

15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.



Their Satanic religion is the mystery religion mentioned here:

Revelation 17

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.



It can't be anything other than the Talmud.

The Star of David, which isn't mentioned by this name anywhere in Scripture, is a better candidate for the mark/number of the Beast than any of the earlier mentioned options.



We are told that wisdom and understanding are involved with recognising the number of the Beast:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.




Those who are unaware of who these jews are definitely lack wisdom and cannot see this truth.

Like I said, the Star of David isn't mentioned by name in Scripture but a star symbol is mentioned in reference to Moloch and Remphan:

Amos 5

26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.


and:

Acts 7

43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.


I have no doubt that this is the Star of David. It also has Kabbalistic meaning which is shrouded in centuries (at least) of mystery.

We are told that these Edomite jews would claim to be poor, return to Jerusalem and build the desolate places:

Malachi 1

4 Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places; thus saith the Lord of hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people against whom the Lord hath indignation for ever.


This prophecy of their return was fulfilled in 1948 with the founding of the political state of Israel.



The destruction of these jews predicted in Malachi is mirrored in many other places including:

Revelation 18

21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.


Anyway, this went a little longer than I expected but I think I got to everything I intended.
 

Panzerhund

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Destructive Ceremonious Master
I want to deal with the Mark of the Beast and the Star of David but first I should probably deal with the concept known as The Antichrist because it often adds to the confusion of Christian eschatology.

I have said much of the following a few times on the bbs so what I want to do here is consolidate and be a little more thoughrough.

Like I have said before; there is no "The Antichrist" anywhere in Scripture.

The term antichrist appears only four times and each time the word translated is a the very specific and clearly understandable word antichristos.



Lets take a look at all four passages to get a solid understanding so that we are never led astray on this issue:

1 John 2

18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1

7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


Those who want to tell you that there is a singular evil entity known as The Antichrist who will appear at some point in the future are mistaken. They are either willfully blind to the above Scriptures or they are deceiving you on purpose.

Every single jew is antichrist. Every single moslem, Hindu, Buddhist, Atheist and every other pagan is antichrist. Scripture makes it clear that there are many antichrists and that they are already in the world. You can also see from 1 John 2:18 and 1 John 4:3 that there was confusion even at that time about the coming of antichrist.

Sometimes certain passages from Daniel are interpreted to support the concept of a singular Antichrist:

Daniel 11

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.


2 Thessalonians 2
is most often used to support this concept of a singular Antichrist who will exalt himself above God, work lying wonders, cause himself to be worshipped etc.:

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


and

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,


You can see how people could become confused by this and how they could be led astray but we are told that a love of the truth will save us from being deceived:

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

This ties in nicely with the Mark of the Beast.

We are told that only those whose names are not written in the Book of Life will be deceived by the Beast:

Revelation 13

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


and:

Revelation 17

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.


Our names were written in the Book of Life before the world was framed. God knew us before we were born:

Jeremiah 1

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


We were already in Heaven and no one can go to Heaven who didn't come from there:

John 3

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


We are the elect and we will not be deceived:

Matthew 24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.


Ok, that's great Astral-Pepe, I feel really relieved that I won't get fooled into taking this Mark of the Beast but what is it exactly?

Before we go further lets look at the two words that get translated as beast in Revelation because only this book talks about the Mark of the Beast directly.

The first word is zoon and it just means a living creature.



This is the word translated beast in reference to the four beasts in attendance to the throne:

Revelation 4

7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.


This is an unfortunate translation because it is confusing given the circumstances. The word probably should have been translated "living creatures" or better yet cherubs because these are likely cherubs.

Notice the similarities to cherubs described in Ezekiel:

Ezekiel 10

14 And every one had four faces: the first face was the face of a cherub, and the second face was the face of a man, and the third the face of a lion, and the fourth the face of an eagle.


Anyway, the other word is the one we are more concerned with here. The word that gets translated as beast in the context of the Mark of the Beast is the word thérion which means a threatening, dangerous animal.





The symbology of the beasts of Revelation and the beasts in the book of Daniel are very similar and Daniel's final beast seems to be the same as the beast referred to in Revelation.

Compare:

Daniel 7

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.


With:

Revelation 13

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.


Over the centuries many have tried to interpret these prophecies in ways that suited their times and their particular denominational slant.

The early Protestant Reformers thought the Beast was the Catholic church or the Pope or some combination of those things.

They made a point to note the seven mountains which the city of Rome sits on:

Revelation 17

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.




and they drew a connection to the number of the Beast with the Roman Church:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.






You still see certain Protestant types, Southern Baptists in particular, promoting this viewpoint.

In response to the Reformers, a Jesuit named Luis del Alcázar wrote Vestigatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi (1614). In this work he makes the case that the vast majority of Biblical prophecy had already been fulfilled by 70AD. The conflict, he contends, is between the church and Judaism initially and then between the church and pagan Rome. The final triumph in Revelation is the triumph of the church.

His book contains some great illustrations that ended up being as influential as his ideas.



You can get his book here but be advised; it is 1000+ pages in Latin:


His view, with some embellishments, is still popular. Those who support it find the number of the Beast in Nero's name:



and they also point to the seven mountains of Rome, but instead they connect them to the Roman Empire.



More recently there have developed newer ideas about what the Beast and it's Mark are.

Some claim the European Union is the Beast, they claim it is attempting to rebuild Babel and they claim that the twelve stars in the EU logo represent the crown of twelve stars mentioned in Revelation 12:

Revelation 12

1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:






This interpretation completely misunderstands the Scriptures. The woman in Revelation 12 is not the whore who rides the Beast but instead she represents the people of God:

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This is about us, only we have the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. We are the remnant of her seed who will fight the dragon. I have mentioned before that this is the very first prophecy in the Bible:

Genesis 3

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.


Some theories are quite simple and don't bother trying to tie Scripture in at all. People have proposed all kinds of things including the coins of Rome, social security numbers, bar codes and, most recently, the Covid vaccine as the Mark of the Beast.




Some of these theories don't stand up to even rudimentary scrutiny:

Revelation 14

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,


Obviously I don't support any of the ideas I have listed so far. The Beast, we are told, will have diverse body parts, seven heads and ten crowns (sometimes horns):

Revelation 13

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.


This is clearly not one single thing, as much as people with an axe to grind want to see it that way.

It is a whole system of evil working at odds with Jesus and against his people. The most striking thing for us should immediately be that the jews are let off the hook by all of these ideas even though they are the central figures in opposition to Christianity.



They are, after all, the Synagogue of Satan:

Revelation 3

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


They are the merchants mentioned here and elsewhere:

Revelation 18

23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


The word translated "sorceries" here is the Greek word pharmakeia:



Clearly they have used medicine and drugs to deceive the nations.



Jerusalem is on seven hills:





Jerusalem is very clearly that great city where Jesus was crucified:

Revelation 11

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.


Sodom means sexual degeneracy and mongrelization while Egypt is symbolic of slavery. "Where also our Lord was crucified" proves this can't be any other place than Jerusalem.

Simple algebra (if A equals B and B equals C then A must also equal C) proves that Jerusalem is also the Babylon mentioned throughout Revelation:

Revelation 14

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.


and the woman riding the Beast:

Revelation 17

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


who is also the whore:

Revelation 17

15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.



Their Satanic religion is the mystery religion mentioned here:

Revelation 17

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.



It can't be anything other than the Talmud.

The Star of David, which isn't mentioned by this name anywhere in Scripture, is a better candidate for the mark/number of the Beast than any of the earlier mentioned options.



We are told that wisdom and understanding are involved with recognising the number of the Beast:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.




Those who are unaware of who these jews are definitely lack wisdom and cannot see this truth.

Like I said, the Star of David isn't mentioned by name in Scripture but a star symbol is mentioned in reference to Moloch and Remphan:

Amos 5

26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.


and:

Acts 7

43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.


I have no doubt that this is the Star of David. It also has Kabbalistic meaning which is shrouded in centuries (at least) of mystery.

We are told that these Edomite jews would claim to be poor, return to Jerusalem and build the desolate places:

Malachi 1

4 Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places; thus saith the Lord of hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people against whom the Lord hath indignation for ever.


This prophecy of their return was fulfilled in 1948 with the founding of the political state of Israel.



The destruction of these jews predicted in Malachi is mirrored in many other places including:

Revelation 18

21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.


Anyway, this went a little longer than I expected but I think I got to everything I intended.
This is exactly what I was hoping for and beyond. Bravo @Astral-Pepe thank you for the time you poured into this masterpiece of research.
 

Italo-Canadian

Jesus is King
Old World Underground
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I want to deal with the Mark of the Beast and the Star of David but first I should probably deal with the concept known as The Antichrist because it often adds to the confusion of Christian eschatology.

I have said much of the following a few times on the bbs so what I want to do here is consolidate and be a little more thoughrough.

Like I have said before; there is no "The Antichrist" anywhere in Scripture.

The term antichrist appears only four times and each time the word translated is a the very specific and clearly understandable word antichristos.



Lets take a look at all four passages to get a solid understanding so that we are never led astray on this issue:

1 John 2

18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1

7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


Those who want to tell you that there is a singular evil entity known as The Antichrist who will appear at some point in the future are mistaken. They are either willfully blind to the above Scriptures or they are deceiving you on purpose.

Every single jew is antichrist. Every single moslem, Hindu, Buddhist, Atheist and every other pagan is antichrist. Scripture makes it clear that there are many antichrists and that they are already in the world. You can also see from 1 John 2:18 and 1 John 4:3 that there was confusion even at that time about the coming of antichrist.

Sometimes certain passages from Daniel are interpreted to support the concept of a singular Antichrist:

Daniel 11

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.


2 Thessalonians 2
is most often used to support this concept of a singular Antichrist who will exalt himself above God, work lying wonders, cause himself to be worshipped etc.:

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


and

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,


You can see how people could become confused by this and how they could be led astray but we are told that a love of the truth will save us from being deceived:

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

This ties in nicely with the Mark of the Beast.

We are told that only those whose names are not written in the Book of Life will be deceived by the Beast:

Revelation 13

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


and:

Revelation 17

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.


Our names were written in the Book of Life before the world was framed. God knew us before we were born:

Jeremiah 1

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


We were already in Heaven and no one can go to Heaven who didn't come from there:

John 3

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


We are the elect and we will not be deceived:

Matthew 24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.


Ok, that's great Astral-Pepe, I feel really relieved that I won't get fooled into taking this Mark of the Beast but what is it exactly?

Before we go further lets look at the two words that get translated as beast in Revelation because only this book talks about the Mark of the Beast directly.

The first word is zoon and it just means a living creature.



This is the word translated beast in reference to the four beasts in attendance to the throne:

Revelation 4

7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.


This is an unfortunate translation because it is confusing given the circumstances. The word probably should have been translated "living creatures" or better yet cherubs because these are likely cherubs.

Notice the similarities to cherubs described in Ezekiel:

Ezekiel 10

14 And every one had four faces: the first face was the face of a cherub, and the second face was the face of a man, and the third the face of a lion, and the fourth the face of an eagle.


Anyway, the other word is the one we are more concerned with here. The word that gets translated as beast in the context of the Mark of the Beast is the word thérion which means a threatening, dangerous animal.





The symbology of the beasts of Revelation and the beasts in the book of Daniel are very similar and Daniel's final beast seems to be the same as the beast referred to in Revelation.

Compare:

Daniel 7

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.


With:

Revelation 13

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.


Over the centuries many have tried to interpret these prophecies in ways that suited their times and their particular denominational slant.

The early Protestant Reformers thought the Beast was the Catholic church or the Pope or some combination of those things.

They made a point to note the seven mountains which the city of Rome sits on:

Revelation 17

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.




and they drew a connection to the number of the Beast with the Roman Church:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.






You still see certain Protestant types, Southern Baptists in particular, promoting this viewpoint.

In response to the Reformers, a Jesuit named Luis del Alcázar wrote Vestigatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi (1614). In this work he makes the case that the vast majority of Biblical prophecy had already been fulfilled by 70AD. The conflict, he contends, is between the church and Judaism initially and then between the church and pagan Rome. The final triumph in Revelation is the triumph of the church.

His book contains some great illustrations that ended up being as influential as his ideas.



You can get his book here but be advised; it is 1000+ pages in Latin:


His view, with some embellishments, is still popular. Those who support it find the number of the Beast in Nero's name:



and they also point to the seven mountains of Rome, but instead they connect them to the Roman Empire.



More recently there have developed newer ideas about what the Beast and it's Mark are.

Some claim the European Union is the Beast, they claim it is attempting to rebuild Babel and they claim that the twelve stars in the EU logo represent the crown of twelve stars mentioned in Revelation 12:

Revelation 12

1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:






This interpretation completely misunderstands the Scriptures. The woman in Revelation 12 is not the whore who rides the Beast but instead she represents the people of God:

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This is about us, only we have the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. We are the remnant of her seed who will fight the dragon. I have mentioned before that this is the very first prophecy in the Bible:

Genesis 3

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.


Some theories are quite simple and don't bother trying to tie Scripture in at all. People have proposed all kinds of things including the coins of Rome, social security numbers, bar codes and, most recently, the Covid vaccine as the Mark of the Beast.




Some of these theories don't stand up to even rudimentary scrutiny:

Revelation 14

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,


Obviously I don't support any of the ideas I have listed so far. The Beast, we are told, will have diverse body parts, seven heads and ten crowns (sometimes horns):

Revelation 13

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.


This is clearly not one single thing, as much as people with an axe to grind want to see it that way.

It is a whole system of evil working at odds with Jesus and against his people. The most striking thing for us should immediately be that the jews are let off the hook by all of these ideas even though they are the central figures in opposition to Christianity.



They are, after all, the Synagogue of Satan:

Revelation 3

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


They are the merchants mentioned here and elsewhere:

Revelation 18

23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


The word translated "sorceries" here is the Greek word pharmakeia:



Clearly they have used medicine and drugs to deceive the nations.



Jerusalem is on seven hills:





Jerusalem is very clearly that great city where Jesus was crucified:

Revelation 11

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.


Sodom means sexual degeneracy and mongrelization while Egypt is symbolic of slavery. "Where also our Lord was crucified" proves this can't be any other place than Jerusalem.

Simple algebra (if A equals B and B equals C then A must also equal C) proves that Jerusalem is also the Babylon mentioned throughout Revelation:

Revelation 14

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.


and the woman riding the Beast:

Revelation 17

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


who is also the whore:

Revelation 17

15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.



Their Satanic religion is the mystery religion mentioned here:

Revelation 17

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.



It can't be anything other than the Talmud.

The Star of David, which isn't mentioned by this name anywhere in Scripture, is a better candidate for the mark/number of the Beast than any of the earlier mentioned options.



We are told that wisdom and understanding are involved with recognising the number of the Beast:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.




Those who are unaware of who these jews are definitely lack wisdom and cannot see this truth.

Like I said, the Star of David isn't mentioned by name in Scripture but a star symbol is mentioned in reference to Moloch and Remphan:

Amos 5

26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.


and:

Acts 7

43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.


I have no doubt that this is the Star of David. It also has Kabbalistic meaning which is shrouded in centuries (at least) of mystery.

We are told that these Edomite jews would claim to be poor, return to Jerusalem and build the desolate places:

Malachi 1

4 Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places; thus saith the Lord of hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people against whom the Lord hath indignation for ever.


This prophecy of their return was fulfilled in 1948 with the founding of the political state of Israel.



The destruction of these jews predicted in Malachi is mirrored in many other places including:

Revelation 18

21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.


Anyway, this went a little longer than I expected but I think I got to everything I intended.
Why did you skip 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7?

And now you know what withholdeth, that he may be revealed in his time.

For the mystery of iniquity already worketh; only that he who now holdeth, do hold, until he be taken out of the way.


I assume you know about the Katechon:

"he who now holdeth" could be a reference to the Chair of St. Peter (the Papacy) of the Roman Catholic Church, which has been an ordering force in Europe and the world since the Ascension of our Lord. The current demonic Pope could spell the removal of the Katechon. I agree with you that the jews are imbued with the spirit of Antichrist.
 

Astral-Pepe

Behind Enemy Lines
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@Panzerhund @Werwolf

Thanks guys, glad you're enjoying it.

I've always wondered a lot about the mentions of Giants and such in the Bible.
I couldn't find the sermon I was looking for. I'm pretty sure it was Wesley Swift so I'll go through his stuff again soon and find it. He talked about that giant's bed that @anti-barabas-ite mentioned and about some giant bones/mummies. I'll ping you when I post it.
 
Last edited:

Kalli

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Old World Underground
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I want to deal with the Mark of the Beast and the Star of David but first I should probably deal with the concept known as The Antichrist because it often adds to the confusion of Christian eschatology.

I have said much of the following a few times on the bbs so what I want to do here is consolidate and be a little more thoughrough.

Like I have said before; there is no "The Antichrist" anywhere in Scripture.

The term antichrist appears only four times and each time the word translated is a the very specific and clearly understandable word antichristos.



Lets take a look at all four passages to get a solid understanding so that we are never led astray on this issue:

1 John 2

18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1 John 2

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 4

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1

7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


Those who want to tell you that there is a singular evil entity known as The Antichrist who will appear at some point in the future are mistaken. They are either willfully blind to the above Scriptures or they are deceiving you on purpose.

Every single jew is antichrist. Every single moslem, Hindu, Buddhist, Atheist and every other pagan is antichrist. Scripture makes it clear that there are many antichrists and that they are already in the world. You can also see from 1 John 2:18 and 1 John 4:3 that there was confusion even at that time about the coming of antichrist.

Sometimes certain passages from Daniel are interpreted to support the concept of a singular Antichrist:

Daniel 11

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.


2 Thessalonians 2
is most often used to support this concept of a singular Antichrist who will exalt himself above God, work lying wonders, cause himself to be worshipped etc.:

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


and

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,


You can see how people could become confused by this and how they could be led astray but we are told that a love of the truth will save us from being deceived:

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

This ties in nicely with the Mark of the Beast.

We are told that only those whose names are not written in the Book of Life will be deceived by the Beast:

Revelation 13

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


and:

Revelation 17

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.


Our names were written in the Book of Life before the world was framed. God knew us before we were born:

Jeremiah 1

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


We were already in Heaven and no one can go to Heaven who didn't come from there:

John 3

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.


We are the elect and we will not be deceived:

Matthew 24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.


Ok, that's great Astral-Pepe, I feel really relieved that I won't get fooled into taking this Mark of the Beast but what is it exactly?

Before we go further lets look at the two words that get translated as beast in Revelation because only this book talks about the Mark of the Beast directly.

The first word is zoon and it just means a living creature.



This is the word translated beast in reference to the four beasts in attendance to the throne:

Revelation 4

7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.


This is an unfortunate translation because it is confusing given the circumstances. The word probably should have been translated "living creatures" or better yet cherubs because these are likely cherubs.

Notice the similarities to cherubs described in Ezekiel:

Ezekiel 10

14 And every one had four faces: the first face was the face of a cherub, and the second face was the face of a man, and the third the face of a lion, and the fourth the face of an eagle.


Anyway, the other word is the one we are more concerned with here. The word that gets translated as beast in the context of the Mark of the Beast is the word thérion which means a threatening, dangerous animal.





The symbology of the beasts of Revelation and the beasts in the book of Daniel are very similar and Daniel's final beast seems to be the same as the beast referred to in Revelation.

Compare:

Daniel 7

25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.


With:

Revelation 13

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.


Over the centuries many have tried to interpret these prophecies in ways that suited their times and their particular denominational slant.

The early Protestant Reformers thought the Beast was the Catholic church or the Pope or some combination of those things.

They made a point to note the seven mountains which the city of Rome sits on:

Revelation 17

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.




and they drew a connection to the number of the Beast with the Roman Church:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.






You still see certain Protestant types, Southern Baptists in particular, promoting this viewpoint.

In response to the Reformers, a Jesuit named Luis del Alcázar wrote Vestigatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi (1614). In this work he makes the case that the vast majority of Biblical prophecy had already been fulfilled by 70AD. The conflict, he contends, is between the church and Judaism initially and then between the church and pagan Rome. The final triumph in Revelation is the triumph of the church.

His book contains some great illustrations that ended up being as influential as his ideas.



You can get his book here but be advised; it is 1000+ pages in Latin:


His view, with some embellishments, is still popular. Those who support it find the number of the Beast in Nero's name:



and they also point to the seven mountains of Rome, but instead they connect them to the Roman Empire.



More recently there have developed newer ideas about what the Beast and it's Mark are.

Some claim the European Union is the Beast, they claim it is attempting to rebuild Babel and they claim that the twelve stars in the EU logo represent the crown of twelve stars mentioned in Revelation 12:

Revelation 12

1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:






This interpretation completely misunderstands the Scriptures. The woman in Revelation 12 is not the whore who rides the Beast but instead she represents the people of God:

17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This is about us, only we have the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. We are the remnant of her seed who will fight the dragon. I have mentioned before that this is the very first prophecy in the Bible:

Genesis 3

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.


Some theories are quite simple and don't bother trying to tie Scripture in at all. People have proposed all kinds of things including the coins of Rome, social security numbers, bar codes and, most recently, the Covid vaccine as the Mark of the Beast.




Some of these theories don't stand up to even rudimentary scrutiny:

Revelation 14

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,


Obviously I don't support any of the ideas I have listed so far. The Beast, we are told, will have diverse body parts, seven heads and ten crowns (sometimes horns):

Revelation 13

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.


This is clearly not one single thing, as much as people with an axe to grind want to see it that way.

It is a whole system of evil working at odds with Jesus and against his people. The most striking thing for us should immediately be that the jews are let off the hook by all of these ideas even though they are the central figures in opposition to Christianity.



They are, after all, the Synagogue of Satan:

Revelation 3

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


They are the merchants mentioned here and elsewhere:

Revelation 18

23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


The word translated "sorceries" here is the Greek word pharmakeia:



Clearly they have used medicine and drugs to deceive the nations.



Jerusalem is on seven hills:





Jerusalem is very clearly that great city where Jesus was crucified:

Revelation 11

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.


Sodom means sexual degeneracy and mongrelization while Egypt is symbolic of slavery. "Where also our Lord was crucified" proves this can't be any other place than Jerusalem.

Simple algebra (if A equals B and B equals C then A must also equal C) proves that Jerusalem is also the Babylon mentioned throughout Revelation:

Revelation 14

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.


and the woman riding the Beast:

Revelation 17

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


who is also the whore:

Revelation 17

15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.



Their Satanic religion is the mystery religion mentioned here:

Revelation 17

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.



It can't be anything other than the Talmud.

The Star of David, which isn't mentioned by this name anywhere in Scripture, is a better candidate for the mark/number of the Beast than any of the earlier mentioned options.



We are told that wisdom and understanding are involved with recognising the number of the Beast:

Revelation 13

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.




Those who are unaware of who these jews are definitely lack wisdom and cannot see this truth.

Like I said, the Star of David isn't mentioned by name in Scripture but a star symbol is mentioned in reference to Moloch and Remphan:

Amos 5

26 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.


and:

Acts 7

43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.


I have no doubt that this is the Star of David. It also has Kabbalistic meaning which is shrouded in centuries (at least) of mystery.

We are told that these Edomite jews would claim to be poor, return to Jerusalem and build the desolate places:

Malachi 1

4 Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places; thus saith the Lord of hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people against whom the Lord hath indignation for ever.


This prophecy of their return was fulfilled in 1948 with the founding of the political state of Israel.



The destruction of these jews predicted in Malachi is mirrored in many other places including:

Revelation 18

21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.


Anyway, this went a little longer than I expected but I think I got to everything I intended.
I have never heard anything like this before, ever. The star being the mark.. the seven hills being Jerusalem - this is mind blowing! Even from an occult perspective it smacks of truth, not to mention the biblical aspect. This post just changed my whole worldview. Thank you! Seriously. I feel like you just gave me the answer to a riddle that I've been trying to solve for twenty years. I really cannot thank you enough for this post.
 

Astral-Pepe

Behind Enemy Lines
Old World Underground
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I assume you know about the Katechon:
I had never read it written out so plainly, thanks. Very surprising for Wikipedia. I will look into it more.

One of the troubles I have always had with Catholic doctrine is that no two Catholics I talk to ever agree on it. It isn't the easiest thing to research.

IMO the Son of Perdition is not the same thing as antichrist, as in some singular evil character. Like I said, this lets all the non-Christians off the hook because they are all antichrist. This is very clear from Scripture.
 

Italo-Canadian

Jesus is King
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One of the troubles I have always had with Catholic doctrine is that no two Catholics I talk to ever agree on it. It isn't the easiest thing to research.

IMO the Son of Perdition is not the same thing as antichrist, as in some singular evil character. Like I said, this lets all the non-Christians off the hook because they are all antichrist. This is very clear from Scripture.
The problem is after the Second Vatican Council much of traditional Catholicism was buried under a lot of "feel good" nonsense that has little to do with much older Catholicism. You're right in saying that Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc., are all antichrist according to St. John because they deny the gospel. A decent article on the Antichrist can be found in the Catholic Encyclopedia (1907):
 

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The problem is after the Second Vatican Council much of traditional Catholicism
I should have dealt with the Katechon and Catholic eschatology a little more deeply. I feel like what I wrote was just about long enough though. It's hard to know where to draw the line.
 

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I'm pretty sure it was Wesley Swift so I'll go through his stuff again soon and find it.
@Werwolf

The sermon was called In The Beginning... God. It has been deleted from YouTube (along with 99% of his other sermons) and I can't find it anywhere.

There is a transcript of it here:


I have it and I thought I got it from archive.org but it doesn't seem to be in this large collection:


Maybe it is not in there or maybe it is named something else IDK.

He deals with giants here as well and I think he repeats much of what he said in the other sermon. I really don't remember.


All of his stuff is terrific IMO. I don't agree with his take in a couple of minor things but I would give him about 98% approval. My main problem is that he conflates Russia with the USSR and he claims Russia is Gog and Magog. Whatever, it is a minor thing and he was a man living during the Cold War so you can understand his point. Gog and Magog sort of is Russia to certain degree anyway so it is a minor issue.
 

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@Werwolf

The sermon was called In The Beginning... God. It has been deleted from YouTube (along with 99% of his other sermons) and I can't find it anywhere.

There is a transcript of it here:


I have it and I thought I got it from archive.org but it doesn't seem to be in this large collection:


Maybe it is not in there or maybe it is named something else IDK.

He deals with giants here as well and I think he repeats much of what he said in the other sermon. I really don't remember.


All of his stuff is terrific IMO. I don't agree with his take in a couple of minor things but I would give him about 98% approval. My main problem is that he conflates Russia with the USSR and he claims Russia is Gog and Magog. Whatever, it is a minor thing and he was a man living during the Cold War so you can understand his point. Gog and Magog sort of is Russia to certain degree anyway so it is a minor issue.
Thank you I will check it out.
 

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Tell us about the goats and tares!!!
 

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I should have dealt with the Katechon and Catholic eschatology a little more deeply. I feel like what I wrote was just about long enough though. It's hard to know where to draw the line.
From a learned Saint and Cardinal of the Catholic Church:
The Patristical Idea of Antichrist
(In Four Lectures.)

Lecture 1. The Times of Antichrist
{44} THE Thessalonian Christians had supposed that the coming of Christ was near at hand. St. Paul writes to warn them against such an expectation. Not that he discountenances their looking out for our Lord's coming,—the contrary; but he tells them that a certain event must come before it, and till that had arrived the end would not be. "Let no man deceive you by any means," he says; "for that Day shall not come, except there come a falling away first,"—and he proceeds "and" except first "that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition."

As long as the world lasts, this passage of Scripture will be full of reverent interest to Christians. It is their duty ever to be watching for the advent of their Lord, to search for the signs of it in all that happens around them; and above all to keep in mind this great and awful sign of which St. Paul speaks to the Thessalonians. As our Lord's first coming had its forerunner, so will the {45} second have its own. The first was "One more than a prophet," the Holy Baptist: the second will be more than an enemy of Christ; it will be the very image of Satan, the fearful and hateful Antichrist. Of him, as described in prophecy, I propose to speak; and, in doing so, I shall follow the exclusive guidance of the ancient Fathers of the Church.

I follow the ancient Fathers, not as thinking that on such a subject they have the weight they possess in the instance of doctrines or ordinances. When they speak of doctrines, they speak of them as being universally held. They are witnesses to the fact of those doctrines having been received, not here or there, but everywhere. We receive those doctrines which they thus teach, not merely because they teach them, but because they bear witness that all Christians everywhere then held them. We take them as honest informants, but not as a sufficient authority in themselves, though they are an authority too. If they were to state these very same doctrines, but say, "These are our opinions: we deduced them from Scripture, and they are true," we might well doubt about receiving them at their hands. We might fairly say, that we had as much right to deduce from Scripture as they had; that deductions of Scripture were mere opinions; that if our deductions agreed with theirs, that would be a happy coincidence, and increase our confidence in them; but if they did not, it could not be helped—we must follow our own light. Doubtless, no man has any right to impose his own deductions upon another, in matters of faith. There is an obvious obligation, indeed, upon the ignorant to submit to those who are better informed; and there is a fitness in the young submitting implicitly for a time to the teaching of their elders; but, beyond this, one man's opinion is not better {46} than another's. But this is not the state of the case as regards the primitive Fathers. They do not speak of their own private opinion; they do not say, "This is true, because we see it in Scripture"—about which there might be differences of judgment—but, "this is true, because in matter of fact it is held, and has ever been held, by all the Churches, down to our times, without interruption, ever since the Apostles:" where the question is merely one of testimony, viz., whether they had the means of knowing that it had been and was so held; for if it was the belief of so many and independent Churches at once, and that, on the ground of its being from the Apostles, doubtless it cannot but be true and Apostolic.

This, I say, is the mode in which the Fathers speak as regards doctrine; but it is otherwise when they interpret prophecy. In this matter there seems to have been no catholic, no formal and distinct, or at least no authoritative traditions; so that when they interpret Scripture they are for the most part giving, and profess to be giving, either their own private opinions, or vague, floating, and merely general anticipations. This is what might have been expected; for it is not ordinarily the course of Divine Providence to interpret prophecy before the event. What the Apostles disclosed concerning the future, was for the most part disclosed by them in private, to individuals—not committed to writing, not intended for the edifying of the body of Christ,—and was soon lost. Thus, in a few verses after the passage I have quoted, St. Paul says, "Remember ye not, that when I was yet with you, I told you these things?" and he writes by hints and allusions, not speaking out. And it shows how little care was taken to discriminate and authenticate his prophetical intimations, that the Thessalonians {47} had adopted an opinion, that he had said—what in fact he had not said—that the Day of Christ was immediately at hand.

Yet, though the Fathers do not convey to us the interpretation of prophecy with the same certainty as they convey doctrine, yet, in proportion to their agreement, their personal weight, and the prevalence, or again the authoritative character of the opinions they are stating, they are to be read with deference; for, to say the least, they are as likely to be right as commentators now; in some respects more so, because the interpretation of prophecy has become in these times a matter of controversy and party. And passion and prejudice have so interfered with soundness of judgment, that it is difficult to say who is to be trusted to interpret it, or whether a private Christian may not be as good an expositor as those by whom the office has been assumed.

1.​

Now to turn to the passage in question, which I shall examine by arguments drawn from Scripture, without being solicitous to agree, or to say why I am at issue, with modern commentators: "That Day shall not come, except there come a falling away first." Here the sign of the second Advent is said to be a certain frightful apostasy, and the manifestation of the man of sin, the son of perdition—that is, as he is commonly called, Antichrist. Our Saviour seems to add, that that sign will immediately precede Him, or that His coming will follow close upon it; for after speaking of "false prophets" and "false Christs," "showing signs and wonders," "iniquity abounding," and "love waxing cold," and the like, He adds, "When ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors." Again {48} He says, "When ye shall see the Abomination of Desolation ... stand in the holy place ... then let them that be in Judea flee into the mountains." [Matt. xxiv. 16, 33.] Indeed, St. Paul also implies this, when he says that Antichrist shall be destroyed by the brightness of Christ's coining.

First, then, I say, if Antichrist is to come immediately before Christ, and to be the sign of His coming, it is manifest that Antichrist is not come yet, but is still to be expected; for, else Christ would have come before now.

Further, it appears that the time of Antichrist's tyranny will be three years and a half, or, as Scripture expresses it, "a time, and times, and a dividing of time," or "forty-two months,"—which is an additional reason for believing he is not come; for, if so, he must have come quite lately, his time being altogether so short; that is, within the last three years, and this we cannot say he has.

Besides, there are two other circumstances of his appearance, which have not been fulfilled. First, a time of unexampled trouble. "Then shall be great tribulation, such as was not from the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be; and except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved." [Matt. xxiv. 21, 22.] This has not yet been. Next, the preaching of the Gospel throughout the world—"And this Gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come." [Matt. xxiv. 14.]

2.​

Now it may be objected to this conclusion, that St. Paul says, in the passage before us, that "the mystery of iniquity doth already work," that is, even in his day, as if Antichrist had in fact come even then. But he would {49} seem to mean merely this, that in his day there were shadows and forebodings, earnests, and operative elements, of that which was one day to come in its fulness. Just as the types of Christ went before Christ, so the shadows of Antichrist precede him. In truth, every event of this world is a type of those that follow, history proceeding forward as a circle ever enlarging. The days of the Apostles typified the last days: there were false Christs, and risings, and troubles, and persecutions, and the judicial destruction of the Jewish Church. In like manner, every age presents its own picture of those still future events, which, and which alone, are the real fulfilment of the prophecy which stands at the head of all of them. Hence St. John says, "Little children, it is the last time; and as ye have heard that the Antichrist shall come, even now are there many Antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time." [1 John ii. 18.] Antichrist was come, and was not come; it was, and it was not the last time. In the sense in which the Apostles' day might be called the "last time," and the end of the world, it was also the time of Antichrist.

A second objection may be made as follows: St. Paul says, "Now ye know what withholdeth, that he (Antichrist) might be revealed in his time." Here a something is mentioned as keeping back the manifestation of the enemy of truth. He proceeds: "He that now withholdeth, will withhold, until he be taken out of the way." Now this restraining power was in early times considered to be the Roman Empire, but the Roman Empire (it is argued) has long been taken out of the way; it follows that Antichrist has long since come. In answer to this objection, I would grant that he "that withholdeth," or "hindereth," means the power of Rome, for all the ancient {50} writers so speak of it. And I grant that as Rome, according to the prophet Daniel's vision, succeeded Greece, so Antichrist succeeds Rome, and the Second Coming succeeds Antichrist [Note 1]. But it does not hence follow that Antichrist is come: for it is not clear that the Roman Empire is gone. Far from it: the Roman Empire in the view of prophecy, remains even to this day. Rome had a very different fate from the other three monsters mentioned by the Prophet, as will be seen by his description of it. "Behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it, and it had ten horns." [Dan. vii. 7.] These ten horns, an Angel informed him, "are ten kings that shall rise out of this kingdom" of Rome. As, then, the ten horns belonged to the fourth beast, and were not separate from it, so the kingdoms, into which the Roman Empire was to be divided, are but the continuation and termination of that Empire itself,—which lasts on, and in some sense lives in the view of prophecy, however we decide the historical question. Consequently, we have not yet seen the end of the Roman Empire. "That which withholdeth" still exists, up to the manifestation of its ten horns; and till it is removed, Antichrist will not come. And from the midst of those horns he will arise, as the same Prophet informs us: "I considered the horns, and behold, there came up among them another little horn; … and behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of a man, and a mouth speaking great things."

Up to the time, then, when Antichrist shall actually appear, there has been and will be a continual effort to manifest him to the world on the part of the powers {51} of evil. The history of the Church is the history of that long birth. "The mystery of iniquity doth already work," says St. Paul. "Even now there are many Antichrists," [1 John ii. 18.] says St. John,—"every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, is not of God; and this is that spirit of the Antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come, and even now already is it in the world." [1 John iv. 3.] It has been at work ever since, from the time of the Apostles, though kept under by him that "withholdeth." At this very time there is a fierce struggle, the spirit of Antichrist attempting to rise, and the political power in those countries which are prophetically Roman, firm and vigorous in repressing it. And in fact, we actually have before our eyes, as our fathers also in the generation before us, a fierce and lawless principle everywhere at work—a spirit of rebellion against God and man, which the powers of government in each country can barely keep under with their greatest efforts. Whether this which we witness be that spirit of Antichrist [Note 2], which is one day at length to be let loose, this ambitious spirit, the parent of all heresy, schism, sedition, revolution, and war—whether this be so or not, at least we know from prophecy that the present framework of society and government, as far as it is the representative of Roman powers, is that which withholdeth, and Antichrist is that which will rise when this restraint fails.

3.​

It has been more or less implied in the foregoing remarks, that Antichrist is one man, an individual, not a power or a kingdom. Such surely is the impression left on the mind by the Scripture notices concerning him, after taking fully into account the figurative character {52} of prophetical language. Consider these passages together, which describe him, and see whether we must not so conclude. First, the passage in St. Paul's Epistle: "That day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition, who is the adversary and rival of all that is called God or worshipped; so that he sitteth as God in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God … Then shall that Wicked One be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of His coming ... whose coming is after the working of Satan, with all power and signs and lying wonders."

Next, in the prophet Daniel: "Another shall rise after them, and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. And he shall speak great words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times, and the dividing of time. But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end." Again: "And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished ... Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the Desire of women, nor regard any god; for he shall magnify himself above all. But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces, and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things." [Dan. vii; xi.] Let it be observed, that Daniel elsewhere describes other kings, and that the event has shown them {53} certainly to be individuals,—for instance, Xerxes, Darius, and Alexander.

And in like manner St. John: "There was given unto him a mouth speaking great things, and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His Name, and His tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them; and power was given him over all kindreds and tongues and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world." [Rev. xiii.]

Further, that by Antichrist is meant some one person, is made probable by the anticipations which, as I have said, have already occurred in history, of the fulfilment of the prophecy. Individual men have arisen actually answering in a great measure to the above descriptions; and this circumstance creates a probability, that the absolute and entire fulfilment which is to come will be in an individual also. The most remarkable of these shadows of the destined scourge appeared before the time of the Apostles, between them and the age of Daniel, viz., the heathen king Antiochus, of whom we read in the books of Maccabees. This instance is the more to the purpose, because he is actually described, (as we suppose) by Daniel, in another part of his prophecy, in terms which seem also to belong to Antichrist, and, as belonging, imply that Antiochus actually was what he seems to be, a type of that more fearful future enemy of the Church. This Antiochus was the savage persecutor of the Jews, in their latter times, as Antichrist {54} will be of the Christians. A few passages from the Maccabees will show you what he was. St. Paul in the text speaks of an Apostasy, and then of Antichrist as following upon it; and thus is the future of the Christian Church typified in the past Jewish history. "In those days went there out of Israel wicked men, who persuaded many, saying, Let us go and make a covenant with the heathen that are round about us: for since we departed from them, we have had much sorrow. So this device pleased them well. Then certain of the people were so forward herein, that they went to the king, who gave them licence to do after the ordinances of the heathen; whereupon they built a place of exercise at Jerusalem, according to the custom of the heathen; and made themselves uncircumcised, and forsook the holy covenant, and joined themselves to the heathen, and were sold to do mischief." Here was the Falling away. After this introduction the Enemy of truth appears. "After that Antiochus had smitten Egypt, he returned again, … and went up against Israel and Jerusalem with a great multitude, and entered proudly into the sanctuary, and took away the golden altar, and the candlestick of light and all the vessels thereof, and the table of the shew-bread, and the pouring vessels, and the vials, and the censers of gold, and the veil, and the crowns, and the golden ornaments that were before the temple; all which he pulled off. And when he had taken all away, he went into his own land, having made a great massacre, and spoken very proudly." After this he set fire to Jerusalem, "and pulled down the houses and walls thereof on every side ... Then built they the city of David with a great and strong wall, ... and they put therein a sinful nation, wicked men, and fortified themselves therein." Next, "King Antiochus wrote {55} to his whole kingdom, that all should be one people, and every one should leave his laws: so all the heathen agreed according to the commandment of the king. Yea, many also of the Israelites consented to his religion, and sacrificed unto idols, and profaned the sabbath." After this he forced these impieties upon the chosen people. All were to be put to death who would not "profane the sabbath and festival days, and pollute the sanctuary and holy people, and set up altars, and groves, and chapels of idols, and sacrifice swine's flesh and unclean beasts," and "leave their children uncircumcised." At length he set up an idol, or, in the words of the history, "the Abomination of Desolation upon the altar, and builded idol altars throughout the cities of Juda on every side ... And when they had rent in pieces the books of the law which they found, they burnt them with fire." It is added, "Howbeit many in Israel were fully resolved and confirmed in themselves not to eat any unclean thing, wherefore they chose rather to die … and there was very great wrath upon Israel." [1 Mac. i.] Here we have presented to us some of the lineaments of Antichrist, who will be such, and worse than such, as Antiochus.

The history of the apostate emperor Julian, who lived between 300 and 400 years after Christ, furnishes us with another approximation to the predicted Antichrist, and an additional reason for thinking he will be one person, not a kingdom, power, or the like.

And so again does the false prophet Mahomet, who propagated his imposture about 600 years after Christ came.

Lastly, that Antichrist is one individual man, not a power,—not a mere ethical spirit, or a political system, not a dynasty, or succession of rulers,—was the universal {56} tradition of the early Church. "We must say," writes St. Jerome upon Daniel, "what has been handed down to us by all ecclesiastical writers, that, in the end of the world, when the Roman Empire is to be destroyed, there will be ten kings, to divide the Roman territory between them, and that an eleventh will rise up, a small king, who will subdue three of the ten, and thereupon receive the submission of the other seven. It is said that 'the Horn had eyes, as the eyes of a man,' lest we should, as some have thought, suppose him to be the evil spirit, or a demon, whereas he is one man, in whom Satan shall dwell bodily. 'And a mouth speaking great things;' for he is the man of sin, the son of perdition, so that he dares to 'sit in the Temple of God, making himself as if God.' 'The beast has been slain, and his carcase has perished;' since Antichrist blasphemes in that united Roman Empire, all its kingdoms are at one and the same time to be abolished, and there shall be no earthly kingdom, but the society of the saints, and the coming of the triumphant Son of God." And Theodoret: "Having spoken of Antiochus Epiphanes, the prophet passes from the figure to the Antitype; for the Antitype of Antiochus is Antichrist, and the figure of Antichrist is Antiochus. As Antiochus compelled the Jews to act impiously, so the Man of Sin, the son of perdition, will make every effort for the seduction of the pious, by false miracles, and by force, and by persecution. As the Lord says, 'Then will be great tribulation, such as never was from the beginning of the world till this time, nor ever shall be." [Note 3]

What I have said upon this subject may be summed up as follows:—that the coming of Christ will be immediately preceded by a very awful and unparalleled {57} outbreak of evil, called by St. Paul an Apostasy, a falling away, in the midst of which a certain terrible Man of sin and Child of perdition, the special and singular enemy of Christ, or Antichrist, will appear; that this will be when revolutions prevail, and the present framework of society breaks to pieces; and that at present the spirit which he will embody and represent is kept under by "the powers that be," but that on their dissolution, he will rise out of their bosom and knit them together again in his own evil way, under his own rule, to the exclusion of the Church.

4.​

It would be out of place to say more than this at present. I will but insist on one particular circumstance contained in St. Paul's announcement which I have already in part commented on.

It is said there will "come a falling away, and the man of sin will be revealed." In other words, the Man of Sin is born of an Apostasy, or at least comes into power through an apostasy, or is preceded by an apostasy, or would not be except for an apostasy. So says the inspired text: now observe, how remarkably the course of Providence, as seen in history, has commented on this prediction.

First, we have a comment in the instance of Antiochus previous to the actual events contemplated in the prophecy. The Israelites, or at least great numbers of them, put off their own sacred religion, and then the enemy was allowed to come in.

Next the apostate emperor Julian, who attempted to overthrow the Church by craft, and introduce paganism back again: it is observable that he was preceded, nay, he was nurtured, by heresy; by that first great heresy which disturbed the peace and purity of the Church. {58} About forty years before he became emperor, arose the pestilent Arian heresy which denied that Christ was God. It ate its way among the rulers of the Church like a canker, and what with the treachery of some, and the mistakes of others, at one time it was all but dominant throughout Christendom. The few holy and faithful men, who witnessed for the Truth, cried out, with awe and terror at the apostasy, that Antichrist was coming. They called it the "forerunner of Antichrist." [Note 4] And true, his Shadow came. Julian was educated in the bosom of Arianism by some of its principal upholders. His tutor was that Eusebius from whom its partizans took their name; and in due time he fell away to paganism, became a hater and persecutor of the Church, and was cut off before he had reigned out the brief period which will be the real Antichrist's duration.

And thirdly, another heresy arose, a heresy in its consequences far more lasting and far-spreading; it was of a twofold character; with two heads, as I may call them, Nestorianism and Eutychianism, apparently opposed to each other, yet acting towards a common end: both in one way or other denied the truth of Christ's gracious incarnation, and tended to destroy the faith of Christians not less certainly, though more insidiously, than the heresy of Arius. It spread through the East and through Egypt, corrupting and poisoning those Churches which had once, alas! been the most flourishing, the earliest abodes and strongholds of revealed truth. Out of this heresy, or at least by means of it, the impostor Mahomet sprang, and formed his creed. Here is another especial Shadow of Antichrist. {59}

These instances give us warning:—Is the enemy of Christ, and His Church, to arise out of a certain special falling away from GOD? And is there no reason to fear that some such Apostasy is gradually preparing, gathering, hastening on in this very day? For is there not at this very time a special effort made almost all over the world, that is, every here and there, more or less in sight or out of sight, in this or that place, but most visibly or formidably in its most civilized and powerful parts, an effort to do without Religion? Is there not an opinion avowed and growing, that a nation has nothing to do with Religion; that it is merely a matter for each man's own conscience?—which is all one with saying that we may let the Truth fail from the earth without trying to continue it in and on after our time. Is there not a vigorous and united movement in all countries to cast down the Church of Christ from power and place? Is there not a feverish and ever-busy endeavour to get rid of the necessity of Religion in public transactions? for example, an attempt to get rid of oaths, under a pretence that they are too sacred for affairs of common life, instead of providing that they be taken more reverently and more suitably? an attempt to educate without Religion?—that is, by putting all forms of Religion together, which comes to the same thing;—an attempt to enforce temperance, and the virtues which flow from it, without Religion, by means of Societies which are built on mere principles of utility? an attempt to make expedience, and not truth, the end and the rule of measures of State and the enactments of Law? an attempt to make numbers, and not the Truth, the ground of maintaining, or not maintaining, this or that creed, as if we had any reason whatever in Scripture for thinking that the many will be in the right, and the {60} few in the wrong? An attempt to deprive the Bible of its one meaning to the exclusion of all other, to make people think that it may have an hundred meanings all equally good, or, in other words, that it has no meaning at all, is a dead letter, and may be put aside? an attempt to supersede Religion altogether, as far as it is external or objective, as far as it is displayed in ordinances, or can be expressed by written words,—to confine it to our inward feelings, and thus, considering how variable, how evanescent our feelings are, an attempt, in fact, to destroy Religion?

Surely, there is at this day a confederacy of evil, marshalling its hosts from all parts of the world, organizing itself, taking its measures, enclosing the Church of Christ as in a net, and preparing the way for a general Apostasy from it. Whether this very Apostasy is to give birth to Antichrist, or whether he is still to be delayed, as he has already been delayed so long, we cannot know; but at any rate this Apostasy, and all its tokens and instruments, are of the Evil One, and savour of death. Far be it from any of us to be of those simple ones who are taken in that snare which is circling around us! Far be it from us to be seduced with the fair promises in which Satan is sure to hide his poison! Do you think he is so unskilful in his craft, as to ask you openly and plainly to join him in his warfare against the Truth? No; he offers you baits to tempt you. He promises you civil liberty; he promises you equality; he promises you trade and wealth; he promises you a remission of taxes; he promises you reform. This is the way in which he conceals from you the kind of work to which he is putting you; he tempts you to rail against your rulers and superiors; he does so himself, and induces you to imitate him; or he promises you illumination, {61}—he offers you knowledge, science, philosophy, enlargement of mind. He scoffs at times gone by; he scoffs at every institution which reveres them. He prompts you what to say, and then listens to you, and praises you, and encourages you. He bids you mount aloft. He shows you how to become as gods. Then he laughs and jokes with you, and gets intimate with you; he takes your hand, and gets his fingers between yours, and grasps them, and then you are his.

Shall we Christians allow ourselves to have lot or part in this matter? Shall we, even with our little finger, help on the Mystery of Iniquity, which is travailing for birth, and convulsing the earth with its pangs? "O my soul, come not thou into their secret; unto their assembly, mine honour, be not thou united." "What fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? Wherefore, come out from among them, and be ye separate," … lest you be workers together with God's enemies, and be opening the way for the Man of Sin, the son of perdition.

I highly recommend you read it to understand that the early Church Fathers knew the Antichrist to be a single man who embodies Satan - just like Jesus is the physical incarnation of the Word of God.
 

Astral-Pepe

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Tell us about the goats and tares!!!
Ok, lets look at the goats first.

The goats are goats by their nature. They are actually nations rather than individuals:

Matthew 25

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:


You'll recall that Jesus only came for his sheep, who are the tribes of Israel:

Matthew 15

24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.


and that Jesus sent his followers only to the lost sheep of Israel:

Matthew 10

6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.


You will also recall that the jews are not his sheep:

John 10

24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.

25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.


No goat can ever become a sheep. No matter how good they are or how much magic baptismal water is sprinkled on them and no matter what magic words they recite about how they accept Jesus, they will always be goats. Goats have no part in the Kingdom of God.

Paul makes it clear on several occasions that the various European peoples he is talking to are the lost sheep and that the jews are not.

He speaks to the Corinthians and tells them that he knows they are the descendants of Moses and were part of the Exodus:

1 Corinthians 10

1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.


Corinthians are Greeks, you can see where Corinth is located:



He speaks to Romans and tells them he knows their forefather is Abraham:

Romans 4

1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?


He also tells them they are his kinsmen after the flesh (meaning by blood relation), that they are part of the covenant and are under the law:

Romans 9

3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;


He tells them that some of those living in the lands of Israel or claiming to be of Israel are not Israel:

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Then he explains that he means these Edomite jews are not of Israel:

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

It is important to remember that the goats are not just jews. Goats are every non-Adamic nation including all the Arabs, mongrels, negros and Asiatics. They can be saved from sin in this life through Jesus Christ but they can not enter the Kingdom of God.

The goats go on the left:

Matthew 25

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.


This is the origin of the left-right political spectrum. Discard that nonsense you learned in PoliSci 101 about the French Parliament. The above passage defines left vs right perfectly and forever.

Those on the left go in the Lake of Fire:

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

There are many more passages dealing with these concepts but I'm going to have to deal with the translation of several words first; most importantly "gentile" and "adoption".
 

Astral-Pepe

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early Church Fathers knew the Antichrist to be a single man who embodies Satan
John Henry Newman wrote in the 1800s so this isn't the thoughts of early church fathers.

It is an interesting study though and worth reading but it confirms my earlier assertion that the concept of a singular Antichrist comes from the Protestant Reformation. Some of those Reformers claimed the Pope was the Antichrist and that the Roman Church was The Beast. The Counter-Reformers (I'm not sure if that is a respectfully term to use so forgive me if it is not), such as Luis del Alcázar, came up with their own theories in response but this was all in the 1600s.

It is important to remember that both sides in that struggle were riddled with jews of the most despicable type. Those kikes took great glee in seeing White Christians at each other's throats. Martin Luther himself was nearly on his deathbed when he finally figured out how rotten they were.

I'd love to read the earliest thoughts of the Catholic church honestly, it is one of the most difficult subjects to research.
 

Werwolf

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John Henry Newman wrote in the 1800s so this isn't the thoughts of early church fathers.

It is an interesting study though and worth reading but it confirms my earlier assertion that the concept of a singular Antichrist comes from the Protestant Reformation. Some of those Reformers claimed the Pope was the Antichrist and that the Roman Church was The Beast. The Counter-Reformers (I'm not sure if that is a respectfully term to use so forgive me if it is not), such as Luis del Alcázar, came up with their own theories in response but this was all in the 1600s.

It is important to remember that both sides in that struggle were riddled with jews of the most despicable type. Those kikes took great glee in seeing White Christians at each other's throats. Martin Luther himself was nearly on his deathbed when he finally figured out how rotten they were.

I'd love to read the earliest thoughts of the Catholic church honestly, it is one of the most difficult subjects to research.
Astral thanks again man, I spent about 2 hours last night reading and annotating in my Bible all the stuff you’ve been linking here. Keep it up. You are helping folks out more than you know.
 

Panzerhund

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Destructive Ceremonious Master
Ok, lets look at the goats first.

The goats are goats by their nature. They are actually nations rather than individuals:

Matthew 25

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:


You'll recall that Jesus only came for his sheep, who are the tribes of Israel:

Matthew 15

24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.


and that Jesus sent his followers only to the lost sheep of Israel:

Matthew 10

6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.


You will also recall that the jews are not his sheep:

John 10

24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.

25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.


No goat can ever become a sheep. No matter how good they are or how much magic baptismal water is sprinkled on them and no matter what magic words they recite about how they accept Jesus, they will always be goats. Goats have no part in the Kingdom of God.

Paul makes it clear on several occasions that the various European peoples he is talking to are the lost sheep and that the jews are not.

He speaks to the Corinthians and tells them that he knows they are the descendants of Moses and were part of the Exodus:

1 Corinthians 10

1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.


Corinthians are Greeks, you can see where Corinth is located:



He speaks to Romans and tells them he knows their forefather is Abraham:

Romans 4

1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?


He also tells them they are his kinsmen after the flesh (meaning by blood relation), that they are part of the covenant and are under the law:

Romans 9

3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;


He tells them that some of those living in the lands of Israel or claiming to be of Israel are not Israel:

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Then he explains that he means these Edomite jews are not of Israel:

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

It is important to remember that the goats are not just jews. Goats are every non-Adamic nation including all the Arabs, mongrels, negros and Asiatics. They can be saved from sin in this life through Jesus Christ but they can not enter the Kingdom of God.

The goats go on the left:

Matthew 25

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.


This is the origin of the left-right political spectrum. Discard that nonsense you learned in PoliSci 101 about the French Parliament. The above passage defines left vs right perfectly and forever.

Those on the left go in the Lake of Fire:

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

There are many more passages dealing with these concepts but I'm going to have to deal with the translation of several words first; most importantly "gentile" and "adoption".
I spent my whole morning prayer time consumed by your post going to my bible and reading.

Thank you brother!

Keep it up you are doing Gods work
 

Astral-Pepe

Behind Enemy Lines
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You guys are more than welcome.

I'll try to deal with the word "gentile" today if I can but I have to take the dog for a walk right now and I have some other things to get done today.
 
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